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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2017 4:01:08 GMT 7
Centrelink's debt: 230,000 have now been hit 5/13 Canberra Times Noel Towell 7 hrs ago HQ Centrelink defended as crisis continues The number of letters sent out under Centrelink's controversial robo-debt policy has soared past 230,000 as the federal appeals tribunal braces for a flood of disputes. Treasury costings have put the price of Centrelink's data-matching and debt recovery at least $93 million, including payments to commercial debt collectors. The election policy costings, from mid-2016 also predict the cash-strapped Administrative Appeals Tribunal will have to find more than $3 million to cope with the expected flood of Centrelink clients taking legal action to fight against debts claimed by the welfare agency. But there is good news for the millions of Australian families who receive family tax benefits; they are not on Centrelink's debt recovery hit list. The Coalition government has vowed to push ahead with the controversial program, that aims to claw back up to $4.5 billion in welfare overpayments in 1.7 million "compliance interventions" in coming years, despite the storm of protest from citizens who say they are being hounded for money they do not owe. Costing the policy for the 2016 election, when it was envisaged that only 750,000 "compliance interventions" would take place, Treasury put the cost at $93.6 million. "This policy would cost DHS [Department of Human Services] approximately $93.6 million to administer, which includes contractors and ICT requirements," the costing document reads. "As specified in the costing request, any additional departmental costs associated with administering this policy is to be met from within the existing resources of DHS. The much smaller Administrative Appeals Tribunal, which hears the first rounds of legal disputes between Centrelink and its clients and which finished the past financial year several hundred thousand dollars in the red, is expected to absorb "approximately $3.3 million in total costs to deliver this proposal." The tribunal, which received more than 15600 applications for reviews of Centrelink decisions in the 12 months to July 2016, was contacted for comment but did not respond before deadline on Thursday. As the federal opposition piled on the pressure on Thursday for the program to be halted, Hank Jongen, spokesman for Centrelink's parent department Human Services, confirmed that more than 232,000 letters had know gone out since the data-matching effort was stepped up in July. "From 1 July 2016, 232,000 letters requesting people to confirm or update their information have been issued," Mr Hank Jongen said. "This letter is not a debt letter and simply asks them to go online and either confirm or update the information. "Since July 2016, 169,000 people have completed the request to confirm or update their information. The spokesman also confirmed the vast majority of letter recipients so far had been mostly young people who had claimed either Newstart or Youth Allowance. "The compliance measure applies to those income support payments where earned income may affect payment eligibility and rates," Mr Jongen said. "This has primarily involved Newstart and Youth Allowance. "This compliance activity does not apply to non-income support payments like FTB. "The first letter generated by the system advises people there is a difference between the information reported to Centrelink and the information reported to the ATO. " www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/centrelinks-debt-230000-have-now-been-hit/ar-AAlNlW2?li=AAabC8j&ocid=spartanntp
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Post by murphy on Jan 13, 2017 6:00:48 GMT 7
The problem is that they're being asked to confirm annual ATO information. When they do that, a debt is raised because the "match" is confirmed. The system isn't dealing with annual vs fortnight reporting.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2017 6:13:37 GMT 7
Centrelink's debt: 230,000 have now been hit The spokesman also confirmed the vast majority of letter recipients so far had been mostly young people who had claimed either Newstart or Youth Allowance. "The compliance measure applies to those income support payments where earned income may affect payment eligibility and rates," Mr Jongen said. "This has primarily involved Newstart and Youth Allowance."This compliance activity does not apply to non-income support payments like FTB. "The first letter generated by the system advises people there is a difference between the information reported to Centrelink and the information reported to the ATO. " www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/centrelinks-debt-230000-have-now-been-hit/ar-AAlNlW2?li=AAabC8j&ocid=spartanntpSo it's mostly those who have the highest rate of unemployment with the least chance of gaining employment who even if gainfully employed would still be doing it tough just trying to find their feet in our really @*&$!% up society. And it appears the government doesn't even recognize non-income support payments as welfare. Grrrrrrrrr! Cheers bear
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Post by Banjo on Jan 13, 2017 11:10:40 GMT 7
Centrelink mess is what the government wantsThe mess created by the Australian Government's bid to automate the search for people who are cheating on their welfare entitlements shows no sign of disappearing, with ministers standing by the methods used. These methods have been shown to be generating false positives by many media organisations but the government refuses to budge. The view of many is that this is typical political behaviour: make a mistake and then refuse to own up to it. But a different theory appears to be more logical: Malcolm Turnbull and his ministers are refusing to budge because they want a situation of this kind to exist. Yes, this is not a cock-up, this is an intended outcome. An examination of the news that has wiped the Centrelink bungle from the headlines provides some illumination: it is all about ministers shoving their snouts into the trough and spending public money as though it was going out of style. One could argue that this is standard fare as far as Australian politicians are concerned. True, but additionally the recent news of this disgusting display of entitlement comes at a time when public funds are low and predicted to go even lower. Hence the Centrelink bungle. It does one thing: it scares the bejesus out of anyone who is contemplating an application to Centrelink for welfare to which they are rightly entitled. The horror stories of people who have been forced to repay money in the latest bungle is enough to keep many others at bay. And this is the reason why the government wanted such a system in place: less money for welfare bludgers means more money for government ministers to spend, spend, spend. The principle appears to be that all Australians are qeual, but government ministers are more equal than others. I have little experience of Centrelink, but a recent visit with my son, who wanted to put in an application for any allowances to which he was entitled, showed clearly that this is not the most efficient outfit in the country. When the computer systems there could not be used to input his application, he was casually told to go back and do it at home. Back home, the form filling took the better part of two hours as the application repeatedly got stuck, each time offering the insane advice that one should try later as the system was experiencing some difficulties. Such issues, plus the fact that one often has to wait four hours or more to speak to a human being at Centrelink, have served to keep many away from ever contacting the organisation. But the government apparently is not content with stripping Centrelink of funds to make it incompetent to this extent. So it has devised an automated system that will put the fear of Moses into young and old who have been dealt a rough hand in life and ensure that they do not try to ever apply for welfare. New applicants to Centrelink will thus be kept to a minimum. And there will be plenty in the trough for poor pollies to dip their snouts and keep foraging. Just one more indication that the myth of public service is just that – a myth. www.itwire.com/open-sauce/76415-centrelink-mess-is-what-the-government-wants.html
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2017 12:10:34 GMT 7
The Centrelink and expenses scandals reveal the rot at the heart of our democracy Jason Wilson We watch in horror at the destructive force of Donald Trump on US politics but Australian democracy may be more vulnerable than we care to admit ‘Malcolm Turnbull’s colleagues – some of them ministers – have freely availed themselves of public largesse, allegedly using travel allowances to scout for investment properties and attend polo matches.’ Contact author @jason_a_w Friday 13 January 2017 14.28 AEDT Last modified on Friday 13 January 2017 15.44 AEDT D onald Trump, as a destructive force, hit the political system of the United States with a resounding bang. But perhaps liberal democracies can also be brought low by means of a long and slow deflation. Institutions may not collapse overnight, just gradually cease to function as they should, and from there cease to attract assent or faith. Elites may not, as they have in the United States, begin howling in unison at the moon about Russian conspiracies, but instead become incrementally more self-serving, more isolated, and less attuned to their ostensible constituencies. Governing ideas may not enter any sudden crisis, but slowly lose any relation either to reality or a broad, popular consensus. In these cases, the telltale signs may be found as much at the margins as the centre, as slow cracks infinitesimally broadening, day by day, slowly but inexorably weakening a structure that everyone assumed would last forever. And guiding assumptions, beliefs, and the whole fabric of common sense that binds any political system may itself be stretched and frayed until it is no longer fit for purpose. Australian democracy right now may be more vulnerable than many care to admit. One reason is that the branch office mentality of so many politicians often leads them to assimilate and ape American trends. The usual suspects have been flaunting their Trump fandom, but others may come to see his victory and his politics as something to be more closely emulated. More serious, though, are multiplying signs of a kind of structural rot whose sources are internal. Twinned national headline political stories – Centrelink’s debt woes and the apparently common abuse of parliamentary entitlements – suggest that our political elites are at least as decadent as their American counterparts. The minister for human services, Alan Tudge, has defended the mechanised but indiscriminate collection of Centrelink debts from citizens because of the money it will save. This reveals how, at the highest echelons of our political life, the idea is now embedded that the primary function of such institutions is not service, let alone welfare, but discipline. On the other hand, Malcolm Turnbull’s colleagues – some of them ministers – have freely availed themselves of public largesse, allegedly using travel allowances to scout for investment properties and attend polo matches. And yet somehow this twinned scandal doesn’t vibe in the way it once might have. It has kindled genuine and widespread public outrage but this seems disconnected from the political system. Sussan Ley resigned as health minister and Turnbull introduced changes to MP entitlements – a year after recommendations were made to overhaul the system – but we’ve been here before. Who expects any more fundamental changes? Who doesn’t think we’ll arrive at this point again? Maybe Steve Cibo is right. Perhaps this kind of catastrophe – with all its serial incompetence and hypocrisy – is now what we now expect. Perhaps we have become accustomed to it. As political theorist Jodi Dean wrote about the mass global protests against the Iraq war, which were similarly ineffectual, “the message was not received. It circulated, reduced to the medium.” This systematic lowering of expectations may be a greater long-term danger than its immediate fruits. The placeholder currently occupying the Lodge – the latest in a sequence stretching back over a long decade – is a living reminder how difficult it is to draw a bead on a government’s short-term failures when they have no discernible long-term projects in mind. Everywhere, there is a sense that no one can imagine any higher task for government than managing an eternal present. As the Great Barrier Reef is pitilessly bleached to the colour of dead bones, Queensland’s government has been bending over backwards to accommodate a massive new coal mine. The inevitable consequences of fostering a dirty and retrograde industry, and the long slide in its price, are never allowed to intrude on the present. That’s because our politics seems incapable, for now, of imagining any future that differs, for good or ill, from whatever is given. If the centre of our politics is such a moral and intellectual vacuum, we can’t be surprised when all kinds of detritus washes in from the fringes. A One Nation candidate who believes that the world’s media fakes refugee photos is, in any case, not so jarring alongside the waving through of Senate inquiries into halal food, or the presumption of guilt that underpins the bipartisan commitment to keeping refugees in offshore prisons. The politicians who posture in opposition to Trump’s wall while supporting the maintenance of our version are just another indicator of the hollowness that reveals itself wherever we knock. They’re all artefacts of drift, of an absence of principle and imagination. Of something that may never manifest itself as a catastrophe, but instead as a steady and remorseless unwinding. A slow leak that can only be patched with belief. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/13/the-centrelink-and-expenses-scandals-reveal-the-rot-at-the-heart-of-our-democracy
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Post by Banjo on Jan 13, 2017 12:18:51 GMT 7
Ley's out, she takes a hit for the team and the press turn away from Centrelink issues.
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Post by latindancer on Jan 13, 2017 13:04:45 GMT 7
So it's mostly those who have the highest rate of unemployment with the least chance of gaining employment who even if gainfully employed would still be doing it tough just trying to find their feet in our really @*&$!% up society. There is one phrase applicable here, and which I have not seen so far : DUTY OF CARE. The government and Centrelink owe their clients, and in particular Disability Pensioners, a duty of care. And they have failed to do so.
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Post by Banjo on Jan 14, 2017 12:47:10 GMT 7
OPINION: My anguish with Centrelink debt recoveryHUMAN Services Minister Alan Tudge needs a strong dose of reality. Obviously Mr Tudge, with his $100,000 plus salary and seemingly unlimited taxpayer-funded expense account, has little idea of how debt recovery letters work for most people. If he did, he wouldn't be defending Centrelink over its debacle that has seen thousands of people receive "letters of demand" for money Centrelink has now determined was wrongly handed out. No one would argue Centrelink has a responsibility to ensure people don't abuse the system. But what is horribly wrong is how Centrelink has gone about it. I too have received a Centrelink "debt recovery" letter and have experienced the horror, angst and frustration of working through it. It sparked frantic calls to Centrelink for information and each time I spent more than 30 minutes on hold, never ever the 11 minutes Mr Tudge apparently said it takes. I've visited Centrelink in my lunch break for answers, but after waiting in a queue I was advised Centrelink staff were on lunch and I had to use a computer. I was also given three different advice from people, one saying I didn't owe anything, another said I was being charged $10 interest a day and yet another saying I wouldn't have to pay the interest. Finally, after lodging a formal complaint, I got through to a human with common sense who explained how it would work and we signed a written agreement on how we would pay the debt back. But when my family tax payment came through, Centrelink removed all the money owed from there without telling me. Money I had planned to spend on other debts owed at a time when finances were extremely tight while paying off Centrelink in the reasonable time frame we agreed to. The kind Centrelink man apologised, but there was really nothing that could be done. A review into Centrelink operations is essential. And politicians need to think very, very carefully before defending a system while their own expense account system is grossly wrong. www.qt.com.au/news/my-anguish-with-centrelink-debt-recovery/3131390/
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Post by krystal on Jan 15, 2017 0:48:45 GMT 7
Was going to leave a comment but she sounds so upset, I didn't want to upset her further by telling her Minister Tudge got paid last financial year $791,940.00 (salary and expenses) plus allowances not $100,000 plus. I think Centrelink should get a new motto based on the motto of Murphy's Law. Murphy's Law - "If anything can go wrong, it will" Centrelink's new motto - "Murphy is an optimist"
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Post by latindancer on Jan 15, 2017 9:57:21 GMT 7
$791,940.00 (salary and expenses) plus allowances not $100,000 plus. That is beyond a joke or an outrage. There's only one word to describe that, and it is : "OBSCENE".
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Post by Banjo on Jan 16, 2017 7:37:28 GMT 7
Centrelink's controversial debt collection system to undergo revamp after Australians were slapped with false debts The Department of Human Services is making cosmetic changes to debt letters Centrelink asks welfare recipients to prove that payments were not made in error Recipients will be offered review into payments before debt-recovery begins But Malcolm Turnbull government is standing by the system even as voters flee New polling shows voters may abandon Coalition due to Centrelink controversy
The controversial Centrelink debt-collection program is getting a makeover. But the Malcolm Turnbull government is standing by the system even as it threatens to erode voter support for the Liberals. The Department of Human Services is making cosmetic changes to the letters sent to thousands of Australians asking welfare recipients to prove that past payments were not made in error. Future letters from Centrelink will be written in a more simplified language and will include a designated 1800 number, the Australian reported. Cosmetic changes are being made to the Centrelink letters sent to thousands of Australians asking welfare recipients to prove that past payments were not made in error Cosmetic changes are being made to the Centrelink letters sent to thousands of Australians asking welfare recipients to prove that past payments were not made in error Welfare recipients will also be offered to have an internal review into their payments before debt-recovery begins, according to the Australian. Additionally, Centrelink will take further measures to ensure letters are sent to recipients' correct addresses. But Human Service Minister Alan Tudge made it clear the program was going to continue essentially unchanged. 'We do not resile from seeking information from welfare recipients when there's a discrepancy between [Australian Taxation Office] data and self-reporting data: it is a core principle we are sticking by,' Mr Tudge said in a comment to the Australian. It remains to be seen whether the makeover will be enough to placate the critics who say the system should be scrapped. Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4122048/Centrelink-s-controversial-debt-collection-undergo-revamp-Australians-slapped-false-debts.html#ixzz4VseTkN1mFollow us: @mailonline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
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Post by Banjo on Jan 16, 2017 9:02:45 GMT 7
Whistleblowers expose true horror of Centrelink debt grab 16Jan, 2017 The Independent Member for Denison, Andrew Wilkie, will reveal the shocking inside story of the flawed Centrelink debt grab that includes staff being set daily debt notice quotas and urged to work overtime and compete to haul in the most debts. Single mother Andrea Russell will also be available to describe her experience of challenging a bogus $11,800 Centrelink debt that she’s had to start repaying while she gathers seven years of payslips from four different employers, including one that no longer exists. Mr Wilkie has today written again to the Commonwealth Ombudsman, this time to report evidence from Centrelink whistleblowers who’ve contacted his office with concerns about the flawed debt recovery process. The letter is attached and includes shocking new information that Centrelink staff are given a quota of six to 10 debt notices a day and encouraged by senior staff to work overtime and compete with each other for the highest quota. Employees are discouraged from questioning debts and discouraged from pausing debt repayments if customers are in financial hardship. Mr Wilkie said the Prime Minister must step in immediately and suspend the automated process that has terrified countless people and even driven some to contemplate taking their own lives. “The system’s a complete dud and must be fixed or binned,” Mr Wilkie said. “The computer says debt, but often there’s no debt. By knowingly issuing these questionable debt notices and collecting money that turns out not to be owed, this Government is stealing from taxpayers. “Every day new cases of bogus debts are coming into my office which has received hundreds of complaints from people who have recounted deeply disturbing stories about Centrelink’s debt hunt. “I’m appalled by all this, appalled that the Government has been aware of the problem for many weeks and taken no action and appalled that the Minister is claiming that there are no problems.” andrewwilkie.org/whistleblowers-expose-true-horror-of-centrelink-debt-grab/
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Post by murphy on Jan 16, 2017 10:35:19 GMT 7
"Employees are discouraged from questioning debts and discouraged from pausing debt repayments if customers are in financial hardship."
Discouraged? They've been told not to do it, point blank, according to the leaked Satanlink memo.
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Post by krystal on Jan 16, 2017 16:12:30 GMT 7
I am rather glad the coalition is doing this.
For years it's been let's slap the unemployed ... let's slap the disabled ... let's slap the single parents.
They have been turning the working class against the less fortunate.
All of a sudden they have included everyone that received a payment from the government. Pensioners, Students, Carers, Families with children and of course the disabled and unemployed.
The rest of the country is beginning to realise exactly how the rest of us have been treated for years.
Without meaning to do so, they have started to bring the country together again, and all of the country against the card carrying silver spoon club.
It's horrendous it had to happen, but if it is what is needed to place the blame exactly where it deserves to be placed - I'm kinda glad it has happened.
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Post by latindancer on Jan 16, 2017 17:27:49 GMT 7
It is a rather negative thing to say, but yes...I agree with you. It needed to happen, although numerous individuals have suffered.
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