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Post by cybergenesis on Apr 9, 2011 8:49:20 GMT 7
Hi.
I am on a DSP, and I have been toying with the idea for some time of living out of Australia as much as possible in a certain other cheaper country, where I feel my quality of life would be much better than here (I am not very happy here in Australia at all, I am really sick of Westernized society but I am not able to work here or overseas).
I have heard the centrelink laws have changed? Here are a few questions, any answers would be really appreciated:
1. Do I have to tell centrelink if I am going overseas? I will probably ring them anyway, so will probably get my own answer to this one.
2. How much of the year or how long can I continue to remain overseas by going for 13 weeks, flying back in and then straight out for another 13 weeks etc?
3. If I go overseas a lot does it make it more likely for me to get a pension review?
4. Oh also if I wanted to effectively stay overseas as much as possible, would ditching my current rental house effect the process at all? I have no current assets or properties, I just rent.
Please note I am actually going overseas for the first time on the 12th (step 1 in my theoretical plan), so if people respond after this I won't be back until about the 12th of May. But *I WILL READ* all responses when I get back. I will check this thread just before I leave as well.
BTW I have lived in Australia my whole life (never been outside it), so there are not current questions regarding my citizenship.
Thanks for your help.
Cyber
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 9:10:01 GMT 7
I think you need to read posts previously about Banjo.
All your questions will be answered.
In a nutshell NO.
NO you will not be able to go to live overseas for too long.
Centrelink are on the process of closing all the loopholes that allow people to live overseas for 13 weeks at a time.
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Post by Banjo on Apr 9, 2011 9:44:52 GMT 7
Welcome to the board cybergenesis. Before you make too many plans I suggest you try a 13 week holiday out of the country to see if you like it. There'll be no trouble with Centrelink, just ring them or go in and inform them of your plans.
I'd suggest you would get a couple of repeat 13 week trips without too much comment but then you have to decide whether you want to spend your life like this. If you do you need to establish your residency credentials in Australia. A house or flat is paramount, if you don't have an address here they will have reason to declare you a non-resident and stop your pension.
As I suggest, do a couple of trips and keep an eye on the situation and what happens to people who have been doing this for a while.
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Post by cybergenesis on Apr 10, 2011 6:32:36 GMT 7
Thanks for the excellent advice everyone. Also your responses have been very quick.
Wow that information is very useful. Of course I have to see if I actually like it overseas, because as people have said if I hate it then its not going to be much use. I am confident I will like it, but don't know for sure.
Damn it sucks about them closing the loophole to stay extended periods outside of Australia. I will have a look around the forum for more info, but does anybody know how definite this legislation is? Ie Possible, likely, definite etc? Are there are links to news articles on these changes? Anyway I'll look around a bit in case everything is horribly obvious and right in front of me, I'm just in a bit of a rush.
Thanks again everyone.
Edit: Okay I have found some of the answers, scary stuff.. Damn fingers crossed the legislation doesn't get through.. BLOODY GOVERNMENT ALWAYS MESSES UP ALL MY PLANS.
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Post by Banjo on Apr 10, 2011 13:22:41 GMT 7
What they will take into consideration is how long you have been on the DSP. If you're a relatively new recipient you're going to be looking at reassessment and retraining which will rule out travel as it does for people on NewStart. The links to both the old legislation and the amendments before the Senate are all on this site, read them carefully and decide for yourself what you consider your rights to be and how far you are willing to go to get them.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2011 13:40:12 GMT 7
Hi Cyber Welcome. I was giving you the worse outcome. Time will tell. Banjos does know a lot, because of his case. It will be interesting when it does actually go through the Senate. We are all waiting to see what happens. Keep watching this space.
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Post by rodcourt49 on Apr 10, 2011 14:04:34 GMT 7
Hi Cyber I'll answer your questions one by one. Yes you have to advise centrelink before you leave. A phone call on the day you leave is good enough. If you don't you will be cut off as soon as they have notification of you going through customs. Currently no limits involved. In May this is likely to change and anyone spending more then 26 weeks outside of Australia will need to have a pretty good reason otherwise bringing their residency into question. Same answer as above. It would not make a difference now but it might make a difference once the drafted legislation came into effect. Before deciding anything, have your trip and follow the work being done in the senate when they sit on May 10th. Planning anything now is pointless, you may hate life overseas plus the government is serious on restricting travel to its citizens. That said, enjoy your holiday! Welcome aboard 'cybergenesis' May 10 is Budget time so next probable sitting date and resumption of 2nd reading of the proposed Bill amendments is Tuesday June 14th.
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Post by cybergenesis on Apr 10, 2011 17:03:42 GMT 7
What they will take into consideration is how long you have been on the DSP. If you're a relatively new recipient you're going to be looking at reassessment and retraining which will rule out travel as it does for people on NewStart. The links to both the old legislation and the amendments before the Senate are all on this site, read them carefully and decide for yourself what you consider your rights to be and how far you are willing to go to get them. Thanks for your and everyone's responses... Thankfully I have been on DSP for over 20 years, so hopefully if I end up wanting to spend a lot of time outside of Australia, that I can. However I hope everyone's rights to leave the country for extended periods are protected.. Its bad enough having to be here every 13 weeks.
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Post by greystoke on Apr 10, 2011 18:34:58 GMT 7
Hi. I have heard the centrelink laws have changed? Here are a few questions, any answers would be really appreciated: 1. Do I have to tell centrelink if I am going overseas? I will probably ring them anyway, so will probably get my own answer to this one. 2. How much of the year or how long can I continue to remain overseas by going for 13 weeks, flying back in and then straight out for another 13 weeks etc? 3. If I go overseas a lot does it make it more likely for me to get a pension review? 4. Oh also if I wanted to effectively stay overseas as much as possible, would ditching my current rental house effect the process at all? I have no current assets or properties, I just rent. Hi Cyber, Welcome to the new and exciting world of DSPoverseas!!! Or, we should welcome each other, as I am also a newbie. I will briefly answer your questions, or give my view on the issues: Question 2: This discussion board was set up in response to legislation restricting overseas residency for DSPers. When the legislation is passed, DSPers will be allowed to travel overseas for two 13-week periods in a year without any trouble, but a third overseas trip will cause their residency status to be reviewed. Question 1 and 3: You should try to be assertive with Centrelink, and assert your legal and human rights at all times. Do some reading about your legal and human rights with regard to Centrelink. There should not be any relationship between overseas travel and a review of your eligibility for the pension. Question 4: 'Ditching your current rental house' will have a major impact on the review of your residency status, if you travel overseas three or more times in a calendar year. However, this is the Catch-22: keeping the rental house will secure your position as an Australian resident, but the cost of paying the rent will take money away from airfares and accomodation and expenses overseas. This is the dilemma faced by DSPers: how to rent or maintain some accomodation in Australia, perhaps only for 3 or 6 months, in order to maintain Australian Resident Status, and then how to juggle expenses so that most of your time and money is spent overseas. FaHCSIA knows that it is difficult for the impoverished OverseasDSPers to manage this juggling act, and they know that the regulations, while ostensibly targeting 'residency', will have an oppressive and restrictive effect on the ability of DSPers to travel overseas at all, even for short periods. This is why it is important for all DSPers to join in the fight to assert the human right of disabled people to travel overseas. I have also been on the DSP for 20 years, but in my case it was 15 years ago that I made the fateful decision to purchase an airline ticket to Asia. I still remember everything, every little detail, about my first time overseas. Buying the ticket, the excitement of the airport, looking down on the vast Australian desert, passing through the foreign immigration and customs, and then the automatic doors of the airport slid open and I was hit in the face by an enormous wall of tropical heat, humidity, and the thousand pungent exotic aromas that make up the 'smell of Asia'. In the next few days I was completely overwhelmed and exhilarated by this futuristic Asian metropolis, and fell completely head over heels in love with Asia, and with overseas travel. You have made the right decision to buy your first air ticket, Cyber. It is a decision which will change your life. Unless of course you find you don't really like overseas travel, and then it is a simple matter to get on the plane and return home. But I urge you to be courageous, be brave, and don't let anyone tell you that disabled people cannot travel overseas. You can, and in fact it is your right and your duty, as a human being, to show the world that disabled people can do wonderful and adventurous things with their lives, and can help others and the world see that all human beings need to be enriched and enlightened by overseas travel, so that those others, in turn, will also help even more people to join us on the path of enlightenment.
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Post by cybergenesis on Apr 11, 2011 3:01:20 GMT 7
Thanks for the amazing responses. This might be the last time I can read this thread until I get back.
Yeah I have been searching for some time to find somewhere that may be different. I have read great amounts of information about where I am going, and theoretically it sounds very well suited to what I know about myself. However, you can never really know until you go and experience something. I have my self doubts, "What am I doing going overseas? Have I gone mad?" etc. I wonder if reality will meet up with my expectations, or if maybe my "disability" will cause me problems fitting in.
I don't know for sure what will happen, all I know is that I am looking for something, and I plan to continue looking.
There are many complex reasons which would take pages to explain about why I have issues with living in Australia- especially in a big city like I do now. I am looking for something different, for a different standard and quality of life, I find that I have become aversive to standard "westernized" Australian culture.
I'll let everyone know how my adventure goes when I get back. Will I find what I am looking for? Will it be a disaster? Or is it just going to be one step in a long journey of reaching out to new things? Will I come running back to Australia full of repentance, vowing never to leave again? Will I get struck down with some exotic disease?
Seeyas
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Post by Banjo on Apr 11, 2011 5:38:14 GMT 7
Hi. I have heard the centrelink laws have changed? Here are a few questions, any answers would be really appreciated: 1. Do I have to tell centrelink if I am going overseas? I will probably ring them anyway, so will probably get my own answer to this one. 2. How much of the year or how long can I continue to remain overseas by going for 13 weeks, flying back in and then straight out for another 13 weeks etc? 3. If I go overseas a lot does it make it more likely for me to get a pension review? 4. Oh also if I wanted to effectively stay overseas as much as possible, would ditching my current rental house effect the process at all? I have no current assets or properties, I just rent. Hi Cyber, Welcome to the new and exciting world of DSPoverseas!!! Or, we should welcome each other, as I am also a newbie. I will briefly answer your questions, or give my view on the issues: Question 2: This discussion board was set up in response to legislation restricting overseas residency for DSPers. When the legislation is passed, DSPers will be allowed to travel overseas for two 13-week periods in a year without any trouble, but a third overseas trip will cause their residency status to be reviewed. Question 1 and 3: You should try to be assertive with Centrelink, and assert your legal and human rights at all times. Do some reading about your legal and human rights with regard to Centrelink. There should not be any relationship between overseas travel and a review of your eligibility for the pension. Question 4: 'Ditching your current rental house' will have a major impact on the review of your residency status, if you travel overseas three or more times in a calendar year. However, this is the Catch-22: keeping the rental house will secure your position as an Australian resident, but the cost of paying the rent will take money away from airfares and accomodation and expenses overseas. This is the dilemma faced by DSPers: how to rent or maintain some accomodation in Australia, perhaps only for 3 or 6 months, in order to maintain Australian Resident Status, and then how to juggle expenses so that most of your time and money is spent overseas. FaHCSIA knows that it is difficult for the impoverished OverseasDSPers to manage this juggling act, and they know that the regulations, while ostensibly targeting 'residency', will have an oppressive and restrictive effect on the ability of DSPers to travel overseas at all, even for short periods. This is why it is important for all DSPers to join in the fight to assert the human right of disabled people to travel overseas. I have also been on the DSP for 20 years, but in my case it was 15 years ago that I made the fateful decision to purchase an airline ticket to Asia. I still remember everything, every little detail, about my first time overseas. Buying the ticket, the excitement of the airport, looking down on the vast Australian desert, passing through the foreign immigration and customs, and then the automatic doors of the airport slid open and I was hit in the face by an enormous wall of tropical heat, humidity, and the thousand pungent exotic aromas that make up the 'smell of Asia'. In the next few days I was completely overwhelmed and exhilarated by this futuristic Asian metropolis, and fell completely head over heels in love with Asia, and with overseas travel. You have made the right decision to buy your first air ticket, Cyber. It is a decision which will change your life. Unless of course you find you don't really like overseas travel, and then it is a simple matter to get on the plane and return home. But I urge you to be courageous, be brave, and don't let anyone tell you that disabled people cannot travel overseas. You can, and in fact it is your right and your duty, as a human being, to show the world that disabled people can do wonderful and adventurous things with their lives, and can help others and the world see that all human beings need to be enriched and enlightened by overseas travel, so that those others, in turn, will also help even more people to join us on the path of enlightenment. You make an interesting comment here... Question 2: This discussion board was set up in response to legislation restricting overseas residency for DSPers. When the legislation is passed, DSPers will be allowed to travel overseas for two 13-week periods in a year without any trouble, but a third overseas trip will cause their residency status to be reviewed. I seem to have overlooked this part of the new amendments to the legislation. do you have some sort of inside information here? My point has always been that there is nothing in black and white regarding things like number of trips in a certain period of time, or total time spent out of the country in a year. My current situation (loss of residency) is certainly the result of Centrelink policy rather than law.
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Post by greystoke on Apr 11, 2011 17:01:46 GMT 7
I seem to have overlooked this part of the new amendments to the legislation. do you have some sort of inside information here? My point has always been that there is nothing in black and white regarding things like number of trips in a certain period of time, or total time spent out of the country in a year. My current situation (loss of residency) is certainly the result of Centrelink policy rather than law. Yes, Mr. Banjo, I read something in black and white, a government document, somewhere on this discussion board, about 26 weeks per calendar being the standard amount of time to avoid a residency review. I am searching the board trying to find it.
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Post by greystoke on Apr 11, 2011 17:14:34 GMT 7
Yes, Banjo, you posted the link to the FaHCSIA website with examples of residence questions. Thanks, RTD -- where is it on the board??
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Post by greystoke on Apr 11, 2011 17:26:36 GMT 7
Here it is..... www.fahcsia.gov.au/guides_acts/ssg/ssguide-3/ssguide-3.1/ssguide-3.1.1/ssguide-3.1.1.10.htmlQuote: 1. Frequency & duration of the person's travel outside Australia A person does not need to be continuously present in a country in order to be residing there. A person holidaying or working temporarily overseas does not necessarily cease to reside in Australia while they are away. It is necessary to find the reason for being overseas and to look closely at the pattern and duration of time spent outside Australia in order to ascertain whether a person continues to reside in Australia. For Australian residence to be maintained during an absence, a person must demonstrate continued physical ties to Australia, the absence must be for a short duration, there must be a purpose for the absence and there must be a proposed end date for the absence. Taken in isolation, a 3 year continuous absence would be regarded as an upper limit to still being considered residing in Australia, unless there are special circumstances delaying a return. When looking at the pattern and duration of time spent outside Australia, if a person regularly spends more than 6 months a year outside Australia, then their residence in Australia is questionable. The purpose of an overseas absence may indicate whether a person continues to reside in Australia. The reason should be consistent with the intended length of the absence. For example, a person working on an 18 month overseas contract posting would still be considered to reside in Australia as long as they have demonstrated ongoing physical ties to Australia and a commitment to return to Australia at the end of the posting. It is not uncommon for a person to remain overseas for a lengthy period of time but state that they intend to return to Australia to live at some uncertain, future date. In general, when a person states that they are leaving Australia temporarily with the intention of returning to Australia, the person's 'intent' becomes less of a factor as the length of the absence increases. A person's physical ties with a country will normally take precedence over their intentions when lengthy periods of time are involved. A person who has spent the majority of their time overseas in the last few years and who returns to Australia to claim a benefit will not necessarily be eligible from the day they return to Australia. The person must demonstrate that their physical ties with Australia have been re-established, or are in the process of being established and that they intend to reside again in Australia.
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Post by deanieweeenie on Aug 23, 2011 13:33:30 GMT 7
This is the issue of going overseas on a dsp in a nut shell
1.Politicians go over seas every day on your taxes, fun and so called business, with the family joined at their naval.. we all have heard the stories of expenses by them, wasted tax money and ongoing rip offs
2. If we can live healthier feel better and food is much much much cheaper and is of NATURAL food quality, not the processed plant shopping center's with chemicals more found in science bottles and not at the illegal food prices charged here in Australia by Woolworth's and Cole's thieves, who taxes the govt loves.. so they allow no price restrictions.....sorrry farmers for your working hard to get the crumbs.....why can't we live overseas
3. If we feel healthier by the climate, the people, the MUCH MUCH less stress, the over policed Australia and the massive, huge, illegal high tax system .. why can't we live overseas ON THE CRUMBS TO MAKE THEM GO FURTHER
4. If a person is noted as not to be reviewed because they cannot EVER work and this saves the Govt huge money in..no concessions, no rent relief, no Medicare over 5 years, ( I went to a private hospital xray, stitches, 5 medications, specialist for $7.00) no wasted reviews to leave you still on the dsp every time because you cannot work anyway, no increases to dsp's living overseas, on and on and on and on and on...no wasted political material in our letter boxes, no Doctor /Specialist costs, hospital costs, saves billions...etc; etc; etc; oh no free train trip once a year to the border and back.. food not included..wow.... thats a great miss... really?
5. We worked and pay taxes in many cases for years and years before injured and now left a loner and alone,.
6. We our in ill health and yet they want to stifle us further
7. Our rights to travel as citizens is questionable under the Geneva convention to note only 1 right
8. No more.. hello, good mornings.. and 'f off' what do you want, you must want something from the Australian people, no more fingers when you drive, bashings, robberies in your home.
9. The attitudes of Australian people has gone as in the past to be free to smile
and the list goes on..
I believe if you have been on Dsp over 20 plus years, its obvious you cannot work and you entail the physical and mental issues then you are impaired to the point your life here is hell, a daily struggle to find enough money to pay the rent, food, the electricity over charging, phone over charging, gas overcharging, water more expensive than gold, the smoke screen taxes, THE NEW SMOKE TAX.. NOT POLLUTION REDUCTION.. A DIRECT TAX the GST let the bright sparks see the light... We are jailed in this country and eat sh*t and take sh*t to survive.. Its our right to receive a pension as its our right due to the fact we are unable to work to live in a place on that pension where at least we have the basic contentment.. Thats not here in Australia. Get over the fairy tales of a few having a Thai girl and bar living like kings. Thats more fantasy than true reality.. I do not agree people should exploit the system,a minority as always affects the rest.. but as you have crook cops, judges, and huge corruption in all areas in This country, please Govt don't add to it by taking advantage of the under privileged and let us live out our remaining years in SOME PEACE without putting us in the streets then asking the public to pay for the homeless, you put us there.
Get with it, if you are deemed cannot be productive but only aggravate society by our physical and mental issues..and then WASTE their taxes as they believe..(wait until they become a vegetable, then you will see the light) let us go to a place where we can live some quality on a benefit we earnt which by the way is NO jackpot, its a survival income. We live in hell, its a country disgrace of impoverished and hurting Dsp people who are suiciding to get free of your bureaucracy every day..
REALITY.. SENATE READ THIS AND STOP TREATING US THE WAY YOU TREAT ABORIGINALS and still do.. like animals..you trained them by force like monkeys.. taking away their kids first,then their benefit to buy only crumbs and dance in circles all day to their grave..They are still on the back burner, the Govt only wasted money to know where, seen to look good to the corrupt controllers of this dead country..e Once a free and fantastic place, now owned by every country except Australia..
Back off. Stop taking our right to ever sh*t
This is the facts.. forget the rhetoric by the Govt.. They save nix by stopping us a chance to live.. In my case I have a boyfriend they are stopping me from living with overseas if they start harassing our rights further....
The bright sparks made a mistake, they are trying to rectify.. they said in legislation we could go overseas for 13 weeks then must return but forget to say how many times we could go overseas in a year.. no that they should ever be able to control our lives like that anyway.. on top of that they allowed all DSP people to live overseas before 1984 then when a senate committee was appearing, one of the 2 never arrived so the smart one brought in 13 weeks max to travel overseas.. Any Dsp person prior to 1984 knows not to step back into Australia DSP then reverts to what we currently have to bear.
Facts over being scared by what they are planning.. Fight all the way to live where you like.. They save billions by letting us go.... its more.. its no Sir/Madam why should I.. They are in a fairy land.. beware the red head..Her parents are wealthy on super pensions.. Forget a crumb from her... Maybe a free? haircut from here gay aquauntance..
Watch their next move..JUNE 2012 after all.. for them it makes good reading if nothing else.. THEY THINK INJURING US FURTHER IF POSSIBLE... IS A GOOD VOTE COLLECTOR.. Australia we are no more our ownself.. we are controlled, directed, brainwashed and covered in corruption, designed with hands tied and mouth bound..
THEY DO NOT GIVE 2 SHI*S FOR US
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