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Post by Banjo on Jul 17, 2011 18:37:10 GMT 7
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 1, 2011 19:25:39 GMT 7
I wish Welfare Rights would put a date on their information. I had looked at the above link when Banjo first posted it.
Soon after, my son re-joined his old employment agency, so that they would pay for the TAFE course he has just started. He is still exempt from having to do anything; look for work, study or attend any appointments until October of this year, due to his medical condition.
At his first appointment, arranged to do the TAFE paperwork, he realised that his consultant did not know how to do it. Apparently she is new in the job, and he had to tell her to raise a purchase order and fax it to the TAFE.
Secondly, she informed him that Centrelink have now changed the rules to be that Employment Agencies can cut off your payments with just the click of one button, if you miss an appointment.
She told him it was a brand new rule, just bought in. It has always been up to Centrelink to make that decision. I cannot work out from the Welfare Rights Organisation website if their information is still valid, nor can I find any reference to that 'new rule' on the Centrelink one.
Having already read the information at the link posted here, it would seem that statement was a lie/threat to ensure that he attends.
He had also told me that she had treated him with disrespect, until he explained that he was unemployed since leaving the work force and study, to have surgery on his arm. She was nicer to him after that.
Last year we were reimbursed for the TAFE deposit we had paid, to our surprise. So, last week he emailed his new consultant his bank account details so that she could refund the deposit to him.
She emailed back that he was not inline to have that money refunded. He argued that he was pretty sure that he was, based on the fact that he was last year.
Two days later he received a reply saying "Ok, ok, you win!" She advised the refund would be processed two days later, and then admitted that he was in line for it all along. We still not have received that money, and we are in need of it.
I have urged him to email them tomorrow, if the money is not in the bank, and request a new consultant. One that knows how to do their job, does not make threats using lies and does not make smart-ass comments when she is proven to be incorrect.
We will advise that if that does not occur, we will apply to DEEWR to be transfered to another service, due to relationship breakdown. Just to let her know that we know our rights, and won't be manipulated with deception.
I don't usually like to be a bitch, but why should we attend these places, only to have to deal with incompetant and condescending people? If they want to play games, we will play back. And this year, we know our rights.
From the link to Welfare Rights Org:
* It is Centrelink, not Employment Service Providers, who makes the decision to impose penalties such as no-show no-pay failures.
* Employment Service Provides have discretion about whether or not to inform Centrelink if you have not participated in their activities.
* While providers want to support you, they are paid to get you into employment.
* Providers are not paid if you do not participate.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 7:58:59 GMT 7
Been in contact with the employment agency this morning, via phone and email. The paperwork for the refund was not processed correctly. 'They thought it had been done, but it seems it was not'. They are going to try to do it today.
They allege that we have treated them with disrespect this morning, by requesting a new consultant, and listing the reasons why. If they want respect, they should do their jobs properly, and not rely on lies to keep clients attending their service.
I sent them a link to this thread, so beware of any negative replies, it will probably be their staff pretending welfare recipients, praising employment agencies and the work that they do.
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Post by Banjo on Aug 2, 2011 9:19:46 GMT 7
I'd welcome these people to come here and give their opinions of their employers.
We have at least three regular posters who were investigators in their former jobs so I'm sure we can winkle out any frauds.
I think that we need to see what people's rights are when dealing with these companies,
Banker and I are busy setting up our new website at the moment... I use the term "I" loosely here, he's doing all the work, but we'll certainly be looking at getting as much information as possible on Job Centres for it.
Edit: I would assume that all of WRG information in their fact sheets is current.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 9:31:39 GMT 7
Three and a half hours after starting to sort this matter out, I am finally getting somewhere.
Despite the fact that we emailed them three working days ago asking if there was a problem with the refund, they have just advised that they needed to see our receipt. I had previously explained that it had been paid over the internet and we did not have one. One arrived in the mail recently, and I have just scanned and sent it to them.
It seems the other problem was that they neglected to record in their file why he had to drop out of TAFE last year, after only attending two classes. According to their records, he never attended at all, and never advised anyone why that was the case.
It seems that requiring bone surgery on one's right arm, is not worth mentioning in their records.
TURSA, TURSA, TURSA. Do we all know that ad jingle? Maybe they should spend more money on staff training, than they do on advertising.
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Post by Banjo on Aug 2, 2011 9:40:09 GMT 7
I'm trying to find a website for The Consumer Resolution and Referral Service which people with Job Centre problems are supposed to complain to.
Anyone got a link?
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 10:02:05 GMT 7
Lol, CRRS. They were who advised my disability employment provider to take out an AVO against me.
An officer from there, who was not the one handling my complaint, phoned me after I had sent in proof of my allegations and told me that I had no complaint. He was rude, aggressive and acted like I was the one doing something wrong.
When I emailed him back letting him know that I did not appreciate his attitude, he phoned On-Q HR and advised them to restrain me. Pretty sure he would have also advised them that I did have the proof of my complaint, and they were also aware I had refused to back down from being denied the rest, under my FOI rights.
I think CRRS is for disability services. The one for normal employment agencies used to be Employment Services Feedback, but that name would have changed in their new shake up. I will go and get some links. However, I can vouch for the fact that Employment Services Feedback is also staffed by people determined to defend these agencies, from our 'nasty little complaints'.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 10:21:00 GMT 7
My internet is too slow today to be able to load the DEEWR website. If you need to complain about an employment service provider, simply go to the same website, click on employment, and there will be an email address shown for complaints.
I would assume the new Disability Employment Australia website would also have an address or portal, for complaints.
Refund being transferred into my son's bank as I type. Tursa must be a bit smarter than On-Q Human Resources, they caved in once they saw their incompetance being discussed on the internet.
Thanks again to Banjo, for providing this forum to voice our outrage at our treatment at the hands of these people and businesses.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 10:27:10 GMT 7
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Post by Banjo on Aug 2, 2011 10:33:11 GMT 7
Thanks Spacey, I'd like to think we helped.
I think the problem with these organisations is that it's a bit like a gold rush in the old days.
All these people grab a pick and shovel and head for the gold fields... read government funding... only to find the hastily selected horse goes lame on the way and the wheels come off their cart.
In a perfect world staff would get better as they gain experience and acquire compassion, but all too often they will become like more than a few Centrelink employees and see clients as the enemy, someone to be got rid of as quickly as possible.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 10:43:35 GMT 7
Yes, they keep advertising for new clients, and yet I read that one of their duties at your first interview with them, is to provide you with a list of appropriate jobs.
So, when they have no jobs to send people to, how are they allowed to keep advertising for new clients? Should they not have to find jobs for their existing clients, before they can take on new people?
Four and a half hours now of trying to get this sorted. Despite their claim this morning that they thought the refund had been issued and could not understand why it is not in our bank, they have kept contacting us since, with new issues to be resolved before it can be finalised.
It is also unfortunate, that I have been blaming the new employee for all of this. It seems she is just the one who appears to have lied to him at the interview. The rest of the mess has been created by, and is being attended to, by some of their more experienced staff!
Talk about wheels coming off wagons!
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 10:51:30 GMT 7
Not everyone does get their refund back. Only those who are classed as Stream 4 or 5, which my son is, mainly due to the fact that my only income is a welfare payment.
They didn't notice that he was Stream 4, was their excuse last week for arguing about it. That classification is made for their information, and no other reason.
I had decided to let it rest last week, rather than have a drama. However, once she had emailed admitting that she had since realised we were entitled to it, and that it would be paid two days hence, I sort of took it into account in our budget this week.
$52 is a lot of money to have paid out of a welfare cheque, and so I would really appreciate it being returned to our coffers.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 2, 2011 12:43:57 GMT 7
Five and a half hours before they realised that it had to be paid back to the same bank account that the fees had been paid from.
I wondered if that would be the case, as it was last year. That I had to go and give his employment consultant my own bank account number, because I had paid the fee at the local TAFE via EFTPOS.
This time the TAFE is not local, and since my son's account is not set up for paying things online, I made the transfer from my account.
My son and I went through the procedure once last year with this company, and yet we understand it better than their own staff.
Once it was legislated that kids had to enrol in a course when unemployment benefits was cancelled for their age bracket, the task of assisting them to enrol was given to these employment agencies. Our local offices alone would have processed many hundreds of these invoices and refunds.
I would expect that it does not come out of their profits, but that they invoice DEEWR for all that they pay out. So again, why give us the run around over money that was not really theirs in the first place? Its like Centrelink employees processing payments for those on welfare, like it comes out of their own pockets.
If standards of delivery and service at these places was monitored by someone other than the department that set them up, they would all receive negative ratings and be the laughing stock of the business world.
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Post by spaceyone on Aug 3, 2011 8:51:17 GMT 7
It is shameful that I had to keep updating this thread yesterday, broadcasting what this employment agency was doing to us, to get the refund we were entitled to.
It was also interesting to learn that they never recorded into their file that there was a reason my son had to quit his job last year and drop out of TAFE.
Prior to doing those things, I had rang this employment service trying to discuss the issues with them, and to ask how I would be able to keep money coming in for him, when he was not studying or working, therefore not entitled to any payment at all under new laws applying the youths. The consultant kept dodging my call, and refused to return it.
I did eventually manage to advise them of what was happening, and why, despite their attempts to stop me. I had also advised the TAFE why he had to drop out.
In the process of the attacks committed against me by Centrelink and my employment agency, it seems my son's one was also enlisted to attack him. We were wary of re-joining them, because of that, but since the TAFE semester was about to start, we decided that dealing with them would be the quickest way to get his enrolment sorted. Was yesterday a case of mismanagement and stupidity on their part, or a continuation of their attack on us from last year?
Employment agencies must be the only businesses in Australia where they are paid in advance of providing a service. The information pack I looked at, in relation to disability employment agencies, stated that they are paid $1,500 for your first interview. They are then given another $1,500 to cover your visits for the next three months. If you are still attending after that, they are then given another $1,500.
No wonder my employment agency claimed that I was attending interviews when I was not. I was exempt for a period of three months, and so did not waste my time going there. After my initial complaint, and receiving my first lot of documents under the FOI laws, I became aware of these false claims. They still refuse to admit that those records are fraudulent, and CRRS and the Privacy Commissioner both determined that if I say I didn't, and they say I did, then they must be telling the truth. Good logic there. They say I should prove it, but when I try to, they then ignore the proof.
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