OAP back in Australia?

[wbmania72]

hi to every1.
my enquiry is about my in-laws
they are 68 and 73yo,both on OAP and living in overseas.
me and my wife the only people they have got.we been hearing for last 2years that their both health is going from bad to worse day by day so we wanna keep an eye on and take care of them as they have got nobody up there to deal with their sickness and old age problems.specially in an emergency.but they shit scared about losing their pensions once they here and want to go back to overseas again.Can they return to Australia due to health reason after been living permanently in overseas for the last 8 years?
do they have to return to Australia permanently so they can get back on healthcare and medicare?
what happens once they decided to go back again?
regards.

[Banker]

In most cases like this C/L would demand they remain in Australia for two years to regain their residency. If they leave again after the two year period they will be limited to the amount of time they are allowed to stay outside Australia before loosing their residency again.

[immiadvice]

With luck they will still be considered resident by Medicare. If not, they will need to show proof of new residency to get medicare cards. Medicare is a lot more lenient of what constitutes residency then Centrelink.

If Centrelink go down the path of making them returned residents then their payments will not be portable for 2 more years.

If they want to keep travelling out of Australia I recommend getting healthcare out of Australia.

[wbmania72]

they like to come and start receiving health benefits because neither we are nor they are will be able to afford their medical bills as we can hardly make the ends meet here and their pensions is worth only a peanut in Australia.we just wanna keep an eye for them,taking to doctors,running to the chemist,cooking and personal support.
what they need to say to C/L to get heath and medicare asap once they arrive here?
what would happens if they receive the benefits once they here,BUT return to overseas after 6 or 12 months?
would they still receive their OAP?
regards

[Banjo]

Seems like they would have to stay the 2 years wb.
If they are citizens they should be able to get back on medicare straight away.
Why don't you ring up medicare and ask?

[wbmania72]

hi banjo
"Seems like they would have to stay the 2 years wb."
you mean they need to stay here for 2 years to receive OAP in overseas again if they ever go back overseas?
their biggest concern is they are not gonna be able to receive their pensions again in overseas after getting benefits here and go back,lets say after 7 or 8 months or so.
they both citizens by the way.regards

[Banjo]

What happens, as far as I can see is that they will be paid the pension as soon as they return to Australia, allowing the time for the application to go through.
If they left within 7 or 8 months, their payments would stop, and be automatically reinstated when they returned to Australia.
If they stayed for 2 years then they would be able to come and go as they please.
Like all of this stuff, Centrelink makes exceptions for certain people, you don't know until you ask them.

The trouble with this type of forum is people in similar situations have come in and asked for advice, then we never hear back about how they got on.

[latindancer]

Nov 13, 2011 18:31:25 GMT 7 Banjo said:

What happens, as far as I can see is that they will be paid the pension as soon as they return to Australia, allowing the time for the application to go through.

Hi Banjo,
Without meaning to be rude, did you misread the original post ? wbmania72 has stated that his in-laws are already receiving the OAP.
Or do you mean their application to return overseas ?

I certainly don't follow the logic of Centrelink making people who are already receiving the OAP overseas, to wait 2 years in Oz before going O/S again......if that is what is being stated on this thread. But then CL do seem rather bureaucratically nightmarish sometimes.

[Banjo]

Yes, it that's what he meant I did misread it.
If they are being paid their pensions overseas I suppose the situation would depend on whether they were under a portability agreement in that country or not.
If not, I presume they can come and go as they please, if they are, I don't know.
Maybe a trip to Welfare Rights is in order.

Feel free to be rude to me LD, other people have no problem with it that I've noticed.

[Banker]

Nov 13, 2011 14:39:37 GMT 7 wbmania72 said:

they like to come and start receiving health benefits because neither we are nor they are will be able to afford their medical bills as we can hardly make the ends meet here and their pensions is worth only a peanut in Australia.we just wanna keep an eye for them,taking to doctors,running to the chemist,cooking and personal support.
what they need to say to C/L to get heath and medicare asap once they arrive here?
what would happens if they receive the benefits once they here,BUT return to overseas after 6 or 12 months?
would they still receive their OAP?
regards

If they are on OAP now and living overseas, to regain residency they must prove to C/L that they will remain in Australia for the next two years. If they can do this C/L will give them concession cards and send them to Medicare to receive their medicare cards.

If they leave Australia before the 2 years is up, their pension and benefits will stop. lets say they leave for 2 months and return, their pension & benefits will start again but that 2 months will be tagged onto the two year time frame.

Perhaps they are in a similar situation to me. I have just returned from OZ & that is what C/L told me.

You asked on another post "Do C/L care"

When I returned in 2008 I got Pneumonia and C/L would not give me a Concession card or emergency health care card. Their attitude was tough luck. What C/L told me in the office is not the same as what they put on my file which I got access to under the FOI. More on this later.

C/L staff playing Doctor again or is it God.

[Banjo]

I'm sorry if I may have mislead wbmania last night, I think my brain is starting to slip out of gear when I'm tired and I have trouble absorbing what I read.

OK, this is what the book says.

There are a number of exceptions to the usual portability rules.

Age pensions are portable indefinitely. (for the rate payable please refer to “How much can be paid” section below)
Australia has a number of International Social Security Agreements that regulate reciprocal portability of benefits between Australia and agreement countries1
These agreements have been established to share the long-term costs of social security coverage for people who move between Australia and the other country, broadly according to the time individuals have lived in each country.
Severely disabled, terminally ill persons receiving the Disability Support Pension (DSP) may continue to receive DSP beyond thirteen weeks if they go permanently overseas to be with or near their family or to return to their country of origin.
Extension of portability beyond 13 weeks is allowed under social security law if a person cannot return to Australia due to specific circumstances beyond their control.

www.facs.gov.au/sa/international/policy/Portability_Policy/Pages/policy-portability_factsheet.aspx

Australia's International Social Security Agreements

Who do agreements help

Agreements help if you have lived in Australia and in an agreement country and have been covered by that other country's social insurance scheme. They only cover pensions, e.g. Age Pension, Disability Support Pension, Carer Payment (adult), Double Orphan Pension and Parenting Payment (Single) and payments covered vary with different agreements.

How do agreements help

Agreements can help by:

adding together your periods of social insurance (or residence in some cases) in an agreement country and your periods of Australian residence to meet the minimum qualifying residence periods for an Australian pension or a pension from the agreement country.
overcoming payment restrictions by the agreement country based on citizenship or country of residence.
enabling you, in some cases, to lodge a claim for a benefit under an agreement while living in a country other than the 2 countries that are party to the agreement.

Note: This is only possible if you live in a country which will accept claims under other international social security agreements, and are claiming a pension under an agreement that allows 3rd-country claims.


How much pension do I get paid under an agreement

Everyone's circumstances are different and it is not possible to advise the amount that you will receive. However, apart from being affected by your income and assets, the following special rules also apply to these payments.

Each country usually pays you a part pension.
Foreign pension rates are usually proportional to the length of your social insurance period.
Australian pensions are usually paid at a proportional rate outside Australia, and as top up pension inside Australia (i.e. any pension you receive from the country whose agreement you are being paid will generally reduce your Australian pension dollar for dollar).
For the Australian pension, some foreign welfare payments are not treated as income.
Some agreements allow special treatment of certain pensions paid by that country's social insurance fund.


How do I claim a foreign pension while in Australia

You can get a claim form for a foreign pension from any agreement country posted to you in Australia by contacting Centrelink International Services on 13 1673 or by visiting any Centrelink Customer Service Centre.

You can only get a claim form for a foreign pension from a non-agreement country by contacting the social security authority in that country. You can get contact details for many countries, or help with your claim by visiting any Centrelink Customer Service Centre or telephoning Centrelink.

Note: If you are receiving or claiming certain Australian payments, including an Australian Age Pension, you (and your partner if applicable) must take steps to get a pension from the country you lived in, or provide a reason why a claim would be unsuccessful.

How do I claim an Australian pension while outside Australia

If you are living in an agreement country, you can claim an Australian pension by:

visiting the relevant offices of the social security authority in any agreement country
telephoning Centrelink International Services on our International numbers, or
downloading our International claim forms.

You cannot claim an Australian pension unless you are residing in Australia OR an agreement country.

Note: If you are claiming certain Australian payments, including Age Pension, you (and your partner if applicable) must take steps to get a pension from the country you lived in, or provide a reason why a claim would be unsuccessful.

www.centrelink.gov.au/internet/internet.nsf/international/pension_agreements.htm

[wbmania72]

from banker;
"If they leave Australia before the 2 years is up, their pension and benefits will stop. lets say they leave for 2 months and return, their pension & benefits will start again but that 2 months will be tagged onto the two year time frame."
i think this statement summons it up all.
from banjo;
"If they are being paid their pensions overseas I suppose the situation would depend on whether they were under a portability agreement in that country or not."
the country they living has no agreement with Australia.
they trying to get in while everybody trying to get out because of living costs.
but both of their pensions worth a considerably good value up there for an old couple.'
they want to come back only because to be next to us for health reasons in case of emergency.they both survived a few stroke up there and lucky to be still alive.next time they may not be so lucky.we'll tell'em all the advises i receive from you guys and rest is up to them
thanx for all the reply's.regards

[pino]

The Australian government refuses to pay the Old Age Pension to citizens that do not reside in Australia, only those that live in countries that have an agreement with Australia seem to be entitled to receive it.
If anyone decides to live anywhere else at retirement, (as in my case after having spent 40 years in the country) practically is labeled a second class citizen, and refused the pension.
The question of residency is nothing but a LOOPHOLE that government chooses to use to deny basic rights, and to money pinch the elderly.
Any developed civilized and democratic country, pays its old citizen the pension where ever they choose to live.
Thousands of Australians are been denied the OAP simply because they choose to live overseas; the residency act should be axed, or equalized. All pensioners, Either both or neither should have the same advantage or disadvantage.
The Australian government must act and take decisive action to rectify this problem, If democracy does not prevail in this matter, then it is true as one said:
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for lunch
The Australian government , are condoning themselves and implying as being corrupt, con artists, morons by choice and above all unfit to govern and subsequently they should be thrown out of office and all their privileges refunded to the state.


Pino - no need to post the same post twice on two threads. I have deleted the second exact post from another thread. Cheers, Rowdy.

[Banjo]

It seems that people are definitely having problems living out side of Australia on the OAP unless they are in a country with an agreement or grandfathered.
I really cannot see where there are residency restrictions in the legislation regarding the OAP and consider it would not stand up in the appeals system.