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Post by trevor on Jul 13, 2012 10:41:13 GMT 7
I spoke to someone at CI international for almost an hour yesterday. Not just anyone, but a person there who decides on whether to grant UP after all the information is put before them.
This person was very helpful and just told me how it is:
1. Any one applying for UP will have to have a new assessment under the new impairment tables, which means you will need to qualify for the DSP all over again. 20 points under the new table and unable to do more than 15 hours work per week. That is the substance of this, you are applying for the DSP all over again under the new system.
2. If you receive 20 points or more under one table (severely impaired) you can be considered for UP, but you will also have to be assessed as not being able to do any work for the next 5 years. We talked at great length about this work requirement of which she is adamant it means NO work. The JCA will decide whether you have this work capacity or not.
3. Centrelink are expecting many people who apply for UP to not satisfy the no future work requirement.
I dont think any of this was overly good news.
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Post by zorro1 on Jul 13, 2012 12:36:12 GMT 7
Okay so we have established what is required , The big question is....can we fail the UP and still keep our DSP at 20 points. Keep in mind the UP is 5 years so in theory we can fail it and still keep our pension because its based on 2 years and not 5
;D clear as mud
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Post by Banjo on Jul 13, 2012 15:25:50 GMT 7
Thanks Trevor, did you happen to get the person's name?
Could you send it by PM if you don't want to put it on the forum.
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Post by rowdy on Jul 13, 2012 15:35:22 GMT 7
Okay so we have established what is required , The big question is....can we fail the UP and still keep our DSP at 20 points. Keep in mind the UP is 5 years so in theory we can fail it and still keep our pension because its based on 2 years and not 5 ;D clear as mud People can still pass the DSP test, but fail to get UP. Failing to get UP will not mean your DSP is cancelled. |
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Post by Banjo on Jul 14, 2012 4:54:09 GMT 7
Okay so we have established what is required , The big question is....can we fail the UP and still keep our DSP at 20 points. Keep in mind the UP is 5 years so in theory we can fail it and still keep our pension because its based on 2 years and not 5 ;D clear as mud People can still pass the DSP test, but fail to get UP. Failing to get UP will not mean your DSP is cancelled. We need to start planning ahead, I've got the ball rolling with an application but remember my old motto? "Hope for the best, prepare for the worst". Lets start working on my appeal now. |
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Post by Denis-NFA on Jul 14, 2012 5:58:06 GMT 7
Banjo
What help would you like?
I will help you in any way I can!
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Post by Banjo on Jul 14, 2012 6:18:45 GMT 7
I've got in touch, once again we have to move behind the scenes.
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Post by baranghope on Jul 14, 2012 6:31:30 GMT 7
DSP Nullius maybe should be the working optic of any "applicant". They are pouring millions into DES (Disability Employment Services) agencies and will have to justify that with sending big numbers of DSPers (40%) in as the funding model is to give the DES $3k per victim. If they can randomly call in my blind and mentally incapacitated cirrhotic DSP (since 97) mate for a JCA, but also request bank statements, ATM slips, and have him fill in a 10 page financial assets form well . . .
The 20 point Med Review is utterly meaningless, and ultimately your fate will be "recommended" by an contracted Assessor who will usually be a "social worker" or have a rehab or psych undergrad degree. There are hardly any medical pros.
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Post by Banjo on Jul 14, 2012 7:05:00 GMT 7
Indeed.
I'm curious to see what the qualifications of some of these medical experts on the SSAT will be.
Would you allow a social worker to pass judgement on your health?
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Post by Denis-NFA on Jul 14, 2012 7:31:44 GMT 7
Can 'we' please start a Company/Business called DSPoverseas?
I checked it out!
Then we can all travel to 'conferences'.
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Post by Banjo on Jul 14, 2012 7:39:14 GMT 7
And claim it on our tax!  |
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Post by baranghope on Jul 14, 2012 7:55:26 GMT 7
Assessors Demographic. See page 28 of the Jackson Report, it is all there. But briefly: only 1% are Registered Medical Practitioners. Accredited or registered: Exercise Physiosologists and Physiotherapists 10%; Rehab Councellors 11%; Occupational Therapists 14%; Psychologists 22%; Reg. Nurses 6%; "Others" 25% (interns); only 4% Social or CL Disability Workers; etc. It is a no-brainer that CL/CRS Australia/HSA or whatever public and private source agencies for their talent cannot afford Med pros: they would charge $300 plus per interview. So none of these characters will care as long as your chronic condition number one has been rated 20 in Canberra. They will just make a personal work ability decision.
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Post by scuzzy on Jul 14, 2012 9:06:39 GMT 7
Assessors Demographic. See page 28 of the Jackson Report, it is all there. But briefly: only 1% are Registered Medical Practitioners. Accredited or registered: Exercise Physiosologists and Physiotherapists 10%; Rehab Councellors 11%; Occupational Therapists 14%; Psychologists 22%; Reg. Nurses 6%; "Others" 25% (interns); only 4% Social or CL Disability Workers; etc. It is a no-brainer that CL/CRS Australia/HSA or whatever public and private source agencies for their talent cannot afford Med pros: they would charge $300 plus per interview. So none of these characters will care as long as your chronic condition number one has been marked 20% in Canberra. They will just make a personal work ability decision. Yep, the 'Wayne Jackson Report' which has now been released under the freedom of information act is the most valuable source of intelligence we have. Anyone who is considering applying for Indefinite Portability or having any other dealing with Centrelink where they'll be subjected to a JCA must read this report first to know what to expect, and to know what the JCA is really all about, which is slashing DSP numbers by 40%. The current changes to DSP policy were adopted as a result of this report that was commisioned by FaHCSIA. If you want to know what's going on in those little heads of theirs, read this report. www.finance.gov.au/foi/disclosure-log/2011/docs/foi_10-27_strategic_review_job_capacity_assessments.pdf |
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Post by scuzzy on Jul 14, 2012 9:41:20 GMT 7
Assessors Demographic. See page 28 of the Jackson Report, it is all there. But briefly: only 1% are Registered Medical Practitioners. Accredited or registered: Exercise Physiosologists and Physiotherapists 10%; Rehab Councellors 11%; Occupational Therapists 14%; Psychologists 22%; Reg. Nurses 6%; "Others" 25% (interns); only 4% Social or CL Disability Workers; etc. It is a no-brainer that CL/CRS Australia/HSA or whatever public and private source agencies for their talent cannot afford Med pros: they would charge $300 plus per interview. So none of these characters will care as long as your chronic condition number one has been marked 20% in Canberra. They will just make a personal work ability decision. Well, like the Wayne Jackson report says Baranghope, medical professionals like doctors are troublesome because they're 'too soft' on people with disabilities, and Centrelink/FaHCSIA will never be able to slash DSP numbers by 40% with those meddlesome Doctors and that inconvenient hippocratic oath of theirs continually getting in the way. Trust me, if they thought that having Doctors involved would help them slash DSP numbers, they'd be right into it regardless of the cost. But unfortunately for them it's the other way around. So, as the report illustrates, when it comes to the big decision, they've made the input from medical professionals basically worthless, regardless of what it proves about the applicants disability. They've instead placed the power of veto with a contracted, non-imparsial, non-professional lackey (JCA) whose sole existence is tell Centrelink what they want to hear to enable them to get people off DSP and onto Newstart. In the paper the other day there was a huge half page ad. It was from FaHCSIA and it was a tender for someone or some group to set up a volunteer work program for DSP'ers. First it was 'work for the dole' , now it's going to be 'volunteer for DSP'. Like the report says , they want people to prove they can't do a certain amount of hours work, not by way of forms and doctors reports, but by physically participating in a work program and either demonstrating they are capable after all, thus resulting in being moved to Newstart, or failing and thus retaining DSP. When this whole thing first came to light, there was a report in the media saying that DSP'ers were going to be 'put through an obstacle course' to keep or gain access to DSP. Liberal Senator Fifield in his speech when 6 week portability was passed made mention of 'making DSP'ers jump through hoops'. We're the rats, DSP is the cheese, and the JCA is the obstacle course. |
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Post by scuzzy on Jul 14, 2012 9:53:12 GMT 7
Ok, I've come up with a fail-safe plan B.
We all change our last names by deed poll to 'Borrowman'. We then rock up to Centrelink and tell them we want to go hang out with our old man who's just been posted as Australia's Ambassador to Vietnam.
Instantly approved Indefinite Portability without having to submit any forms, reports or go through a JCA or work program. I guarantee it.
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