Specialist's report completely ignored!

[aussieinusa]

I've finally worked out what went wrong with my recent reassessment, in which they downgraded me from 'severely disabled' to merely 'disabled'... even though some of the health issues I have, which were thought to be temporary at the last assessment many years ago, turned out to be permanent.

What went wrong? Centrelink completely ignored the report from my specialist!

The main doctors report (i.e. the forms you have to get filled in) was completed by my GP, but he was in a hurry and doesn't specialise in my particular condition anyway, so he stated the diagnosis but not all the ways it causes impairment. I submitted that, then went to my specialist and got a more detailed report from him, which I took to the Job Capacity Assessment. The 'assessor' barely glanced at it, and didn't seem to understand what it said or why it was medically relevant. She didn't want to take a copy of it to go into my file, but I was very insistent, and basically wouldn't leave until she'd photocopied it to go into my file.

So after I found out that I'm not 'severely disabled' after all, I requested my file under FOI. I've finally waded through all of it, and -- surprise! -- no specialist's report.

I find this appalling. NOBODY at Centrelink is a medical specialist who treats thousands of people with the condition I have each year. NOBODY there really knows that much about it, frankly. It's not CL's job to be highly trained medical specialists... so they are supposed to take notice of the reports they get from people who are. To simply lose a specialist's report is not OK.

The net effect of this was that the secondary conditions I have (which aren't other diagnosed conditions, as they are directly caused by another medical condition, but also aren't something everyone with my medical condition has) were not taken into account... so they've rated me as about half as impaired as I actually am. Brilliant.

I'm pretty sure no longer being 'severely disabled' will cause me issues later down the line, but when I called to ask for an ARO I was told I shouldn't because it won't change my payments now, and of course threatened that my payments would be cut off entirely if I asked for a review.

Not sure what I'm going to do, although I'm considering making a formal complaint re them losing/ignoring my specialist's report.

[Deleted]

Fight the buggers with tooth and nail AussieinUSA, and don't stop. I find it ludicrous that the taxpayer has to fund all the appeal processes because of their continued and ongoing dim-witted fckn incompetence! So wouldn't it be wonderful if we could all be magically healed of our afflictions, as expediently as they are to magically downgrade us to what and how they see fit? When I filled out their forms I ticked multiple boxes answering single questions, and added pages of affidavits and clarifications to my submission so they couldn't just gloss over it, and then they had to work for their money! Then once I received my complete JCA file I noticed how they didn't really want to grant me "IP" at all, but the manner in which I'd presented my reports left them little choice and seemed to confuse them big-time! They would have looked rather fckn stupid if they did fail me, because as with you; they had completely absolved/cured me of my life long mental-disorders, which had seen me placed on the DSP 5 years earlier to start with. Instead; they reinvented me into a full blown alcoholic, and totally disregarded my previous prognosis; so wouldn't that have went over well at some appeals process in front of an objective arbiter?

How pensioners are being treated is bad enough alone; yet, when they totally disregard, diminish, re-evaluate, and just blatantly ignore expert medical advice, opinions and reports, then it has to be regarded as criminal. Nothing more and certainly nothing less! When a person spends enough time at this site reviewing peoples testimonials, then it soon becomes apparent that the time will definitely come, where they will not only be responsible for peoples suicides, but more frequent violent and aggressive attacks taking place within C/L offices also! Most pensioners are far too sick either physically/psychologically, or are merely too timid to create a fuss and have to suffer these human rights violations. However; many psychologically unsound people such as myself, when cornered and with nothing left in life to lose, can turn aggressive or violent immediately and then they will ask the question, why did this happen? Obviously it happens because these weak minions are being handed unregulated discretionary powers with free reign over people’s lives and families futures; where they themselves probably have little, or no such power in their own social circles. It is human nature unfortunately and has been that way for aeons, and the only way to fully protect ourselves against it in my opinion, is to slow them down and play the game at your own speed and under your own rules.

When I joined this site in June last year I didn’t even know about “IP” and certainly didn’t know what I was up against in trying to achieve it. But I had dream like Martin Luther, and that was to travel freely and at length because I thought it my god given right, and so nobody was going to deny me that right. Then I began to read testimonials and posts to learn as much as I could to formulate my plan of attack, and I attacked three weeks later on the 2nd July when the ground was still untested. But after 13 weeks I had my desired result, and within the time since then I have begun to fully understand how cunning and manipulative C/L truly are. My heart bleeds for all those that are bullied, harassed and coerced into anything that is less than acceptable, and as Banjo & Banker constantly state, they are certainly not our friends. So it is our rightful duty to ourselves to fight them at every turn if necessary, and I truly pray that our more timid Team members are starting to understand B&B’s words of wisdom. I wish you all the best AussieinUSA, but never give up the fight for your right of self-determination; I also extend these thoughts to the rest of the Team! Be Safe and God Bless…

[latindancer]

Errors compound, then you fall through the cracks.

Error # 1 : Your doctor was in a hurry and doesn't specialise in your particular condition anyway.
Error # 2 : The Centrelink JCA stuffed up submitting your specialist's report.
Error # 3 : Despite your complaints about #2, nothing was done....leaving you in a terrible position.

You must do as Cheetalz says, and fight the buggers with tooth and nail....but patiently and calmly.
I had this same kind of stuff-up when I was originally being assessed, and luckily after my complaint was heard, and I was sent to a specialist (I was originally assessed by a govt doctor....a real cynic).
Just keep going higher up till someone with intelligence answers your call. You are entitled to speak to heads of branches. Don't butt your head against a wall by arguing with people who are not co-operative. Just say thankyou and goodbye. Then phone back to someone else.

[Banjo]

I was browsing the latest edition of the impairment tables/the Act and it's quite specific on doctors reports.

7 Information that must be taken into account in applying the Tables

(1) Subject to subsection (2), in applying the Tables the following information must be taken into account:

(a) the information provided by the health professionals specified in the relevant Table; and

(b) any additional medical or work capacity information that may be available; and

(c) any information that is required to be taken into account under the Tables, including as specified in the introduction to each Table.

(2) A person may be asked to demonstrate abilities described in the Tables.

8 Information that must not be taken into account in applying the Tables

(1) Symptoms reported by a person in relation to their condition can only be taken into account where there is corroborating evidence.

Note: Examples of the corroborating evidence that may be taken into account are set out in the Introduction of each Table in Part 3 of this Determination.

(2) Unless required under the Tables, the impact of non-medical factors when assessing a person’s impairment must not be taken into account.

Example: Unless specifically referred to by a descriptor in a Table, the following must not be taken into account in assessing an impairment: the availability of suitable work in the person’s local community; English language competence; age; gender; level of education; numeracy and literacy skills; level of work skills and experience; social or domestic situation; level of personal motivation; or religious or cultural factors.

[mick]

Unfortunately some people at C/L believe they know more than qualified medical experts, sometimes overriding them. Some also believe that they are working for ASIO.

[aussieinusa]

Thanks Cheetalz.

Turns out, the 20 points under one table they did award means I'm still 'severely disabled'... so I guess the staff figured that since I apparently qualified even without the specialist's report, they didn't need to take notice of it. Hopefully their under-estimation of my 'disabledness' won't cause problems later on, though.

I get very frustrated with them. Even if they make the 'right' decision, I would prefer that they are properly procedurally fair, i.e. which follow their own stated rules, including our right to present further medical evidence. We have to follow the rules exactly; why shouldn't they??

[aussieinusa]

mick, that is so true. I've encountered a few CL staff with amazing diagnostic abilities; they apparently have some kind of magical power to see through clothes, skin etc to the underlying injury site, which they diagnose as 'good as new'. Although the ones who can do that with mental illness are even more impressive; they must be telepathic or something!

[Banker]

Jul 27, 2013 19:48:03 GMT 7 aussieinusa said:

Thanks Cheetalz.

Turns out, the 20 points under one table they did award means I'm still 'severely disabled'... so I guess the staff figured that since I apparently qualified even without the specialist's report, they didn't need to take notice of it. Hopefully their under-estimation of my 'disabledness' won't cause problems later on, though.

I get very frustrated with them. Even if they make the 'right' decision, I would prefer that they are properly procedurally fair, i.e. which follow their own stated rules, including our right to present further medical evidence. We have to follow the rules exactly; why shouldn't they??

Because if they did follow the rules they would lose a lot more appeals and they could not bluff the Pensioners.

[Banker]

Jul 27, 2013 19:51:05 GMT 7 aussieinusa said:

mick, that is so true. I've encountered a few CL staff with amazing diagnostic abilities; they apparently have some kind of magical power to see through clothes, skin etc to the underlying injury site, which they diagnose as 'good as new'. Although the ones who can do that with mental illness are even more impressive; they must be telepathic or something!

This has been a sore point with me for a long time, after a friend of mine got bladder cancer, he was put on kemo and had surgery, went to C/L with certificates from the G.P and his specialist saying that he could not work but C/L staff with their X Ray vision put him on newstart, more bluff tactics by C/L staff.

[Banjo]

It's wrong, but they only have to look in their book of "rules" and it quite clearly states that a condition has to stabilise to get the DSP.
We've seen this more than once with cancer sufferers.
For what Its worth they usually back pay if a permanent disability results.
Unless you die of course which results in a saving which is probably why they do it.

[Deleted]

Jul 27, 2013 19:48:03 GMT 7 aussieinusa said:

Thanks Cheetalz.

Turns out, the 20 points under one table they did award means I'm still 'severely disabled'... so I guess the staff figured that since I apparently qualified even without the specialist's report, they didn't need to take notice of it. Hopefully their under-estimation of my 'disabledness' won't cause problems later on, though.

I get very frustrated with them. Even if they make the 'right' decision, I would prefer that they are properly procedurally fair, i.e. which follow their own stated rules, including our right to present further medical evidence. We have to follow the rules exactly; why shouldn't they??

Your welcome love, and good to see they saw the error in their dictatorial ways; but just keep all your evidence in place in case they come at you later. Its a sad state of affairs when we can't fully trust the integrity of our governmental departments and their officers, but all's we can do is constantly prepare for the next gunfight?

[Denis-NFA]

aussieinusa,

You have to keep going to so called experts.

And tell them straight up that you are going for unlimited portability!

And then prove to those experts that you know more about your condition than they can ever know.

[mick]

Jul 28, 2013 14:00:28 GMT 7 Denis-NFA said:

aussieinusa,

You have to keep going to so called experts.

And tell them straight up that you are going for unlimited portability!

And then prove to those experts that you know more about your condition than they can ever know.

Yes I agree, but I have also found that some experts don't like being told anything even when you do know more about yourself than them. Sometimes I think that because they have been to uni and have degrees they think they are god, namely Psychiatrists. But anyone that can read and write can go to uni, I might do so myself...
Mental health is an absolute minefield, where the medicos can only go on how you present to them that day. Most will also have an eye on the clock for medicare purposes!