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Post by dazinthai on Mar 21, 2020 12:50:41 GMT 7
Hi all,
This post can be moved to correct place. I have only posted one thread before a couple years back.
Ok, a long story as short as i can.
My wife and I retired, sold up and moved to Thailand to live. Things have not gone well. My wife has returned to Australia to be carer for her mum and dad. She is living in their house with them. She is on a carers payment and allowances. Due to certain commitments I have remained in Thailand for awhile. I plan to go back to live in the next couple of years. Due to circumstances I do not wish to go into on here if her parents are still alive when I return I will be living separated until her parents are no longer around.
Initially she registered us as married on making her claim for payments. I am just wondering now if it would be more beneficial to her, and maybe me at a later date to register as separated/single until such time as we can be living together again. She is only 61 and a long way off OAP, which is obviously not needed at this point in time. I am still just over 2 years away from being eligible for my OAP. Well maybe as I am getting conflicting stories after being in Thailand 7 years as to when I will be entitled to the OAP in Australia. But that is another story.
Had a bit of a look at the Centrelink site but, as everyone is aware, very hard to navigate. I will suggest to her she visit CL and see if she can find any info but I am asking here as to if anyone can give some advise in this matter. We are not really doing anything illegal as we are separated. Our investments have taken a beating for various reason so I guess they would have to be split.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Darral.
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Post by bear on Mar 21, 2020 19:06:37 GMT 7
Welcome back dazinthai ......First things first!! Aged pension eligibility dates as per link: www.dss.gov.au/seniors/benefits-payments/age-pensionYou must be in Australia to claim OAP. There are rules surrounding OAP portability that won't impact you unless you want to return to Thailand within two years of having your payment granted. Hopefully a member with carer's payment experience can answer your inquiries about possible difference in payments for your wife. Generally though, if you are separated you would apply as a single. The only reason being separated comes in, is if a couple is separated and living under the same roof. In your case this doesn't seem like it will ever apply, either now, or in the future. As far as your investments go, I'd think that is a personal matter between the two of you. Depending on the amount, your wife may see a decrease in her payments due to an increase in her liquid assets, which the department should be advised of. When you finally return to Australia, my advice would be, to be consistent with however your wife is registered. Cheers bear |
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Post by dazinthai on Mar 21, 2020 20:06:13 GMT 7
Welcome back dazinthai ......First things first!! Aged pension eligibility dates as per link: www.dss.gov.au/seniors/benefits-payments/age-pensionYou must be in Australia to claim OAP. There are rules surrounding OAP portability that won't impact you unless you want to return to Thailand within two years of having your payment granted. Thats what I was thought was the case. When I was there last August I visited Centrelink to try find out. They didn't know and gave me the number for ISS. I phoned them when I got back to Thailand and I was informed that I would need to be back in Thailand 2 years before I could make a claim even if I had reached eligibiity age. I asked why and he just said about the portability. I said I would not be coming back here and he said didn't matter but the 2 year wait would apply so that they are certain. |
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Post by itsmylife08 on Mar 21, 2020 20:41:07 GMT 7
Maybe you could apply for Section 24 and be paid as a single person and not as a married couple
Regards Itsa
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Post by tasjo on Mar 21, 2020 20:44:19 GMT 7
It would probably be beneficial to report your separated status now and then if/when you get back together you report back to Centrelink that you are back together. As you mentioned, you aren't lying as you are separated and will remain so for the foreseeable future.
I have read conflicting information when people stay married but I believe if you can demonstrate your finances and living arrangements are separate then your wife would be entitled to the single rate of carers payment (which is approx $200-$250 a fortnight more I think). She may need to get statements from non family members (if her parents have any other assistance from care providers?) To prove you don't live with her but from what you have said it seems she should be on single rate
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Post by bear on Mar 21, 2020 21:16:01 GMT 7
Welcome back dazinthai ......First things first!! Aged pension eligibility dates as per link: www.dss.gov.au/seniors/benefits-payments/age-pensionYou must be in Australia to claim OAP. There are rules surrounding OAP portability that won't impact you unless you want to return to Thailand within two years of having your payment granted. Thats what I was thought was the case. When I was there last August I visited Centrelink to try find out. They didn't know and gave me the number for ISS. I phoned them when I got back to Thailand and I was informed that I would need to be back in Thailand 2 years before I could make a claim even if I had reached eligibiity age. I asked why and he just said about the portability. I said I would not be coming back here and he said didn't matter but the 2 year wait would apply so that they are certain. They are having a lend dazinthai. They can't dictate where you have to be and for how long before you make a claim for your OAP. If you go back to claim OAP when it's due, and you leave the country within two years your pension will be stopped. If you go back two years before your due, you get portability immediately. The only thing they need to be certain of is your date of birth. Just to clarify: they told you you'd need to spend two years in Thailand before you could make a claim; even if you were eligible? If so, it's BS!! If you have reached eligible age, are present in Australia you can apply up to three months before your actual date. If your on a goverment payment, they will send you a letter two months before. These pre dates allow you to submit whatever documents they require so as your payment will start at the correct time. Cheers bear |
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Post by dazinthai on Mar 22, 2020 7:12:37 GMT 7
Maybe you could apply for Section 24 and be paid as a single person and not as a married couple Regards Itsa Ok thanks for that, will look into it. |
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Post by dazinthai on Mar 22, 2020 7:20:03 GMT 7
It would probably be beneficial to report your separated status now and then if/when you get back together you report back to Centrelink that you are back together. As you mentioned, you aren't lying as you are separated and will remain so for the foreseeable future. I have read conflicting information when people stay married but I believe if you can demonstrate your finances and living arrangements are separate then your wife would be entitled to the single rate of carers payment (which is approx $200-$250 a fortnight more I think). She may need to get statements from non family members (if her parents have any other assistance from care providers?) To prove you don't live with her but from what you have said it seems she should be on single rate Thats what I am referring to, to her getting more carers payment being separate. She has one sister but she has her own family. My wife has cared for her parents for nearly 2 years continuous now without a single day of respite. Fairly easy to prove we don't live together is she is in Brisbane, Australia and I am in Chiang Mai Thailand and my passport will show I have only been back 2 x 1 week visits in last 2 years. I am not receiving any payments from anyone, purely relying on investments which are rapidly dwindling. Amazes me that maybe we have to prove we are separate but people can live under same roof and get paid separate. |
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Post by dazinthai on Mar 22, 2020 7:30:31 GMT 7
They are having a lend dazinthai . They can't dictate where you have to be and for how long before you make a claim for your OAP. If you go back to claim OAP when it's due, and you leave the country within two years your pension will be stopped. If you go back two years before your due, you get portability immediately. The only thing they need to be certain of is your date of birth. Just to clarify: they told you you'd need to spend two years in Thailand before you could make a claim; even if you were eligible? If so, it's BS!! If you have reached eligible age, are present in Australia you can apply up to three months before your actual date. If your on a goverment payment, they will send you a letter two months before. These pre dates allow you to submit whatever documents they require so as your payment will start at the correct time. Cheers bear I explained to him that I have been in Thailand around 6 years at that time and told him I was getting conflicting stories as to when I would be entitled to the OAP other than entitlement age. I told him I knew about the portability requirement of 2 years but I said my intention was NOT to come back to Thailand. He said it didn't matter because I had been here so long (6 years) I would need to be back in Australia for 2 years before I would be able to apply even if past my entitlement age. I said I can understand about portability but I could not understand what he was saying. He said its to make sure I don't go back to thailand in under 2 years. I said If i am getting paid the OAP and I do go back just take it off me. I told him I had asked my accountant in Australia and he said I would be still classed as a resident. The ISS guy then became sarcastic and said "who do you think should know and who should I listen to, an accountant or someone who works for Centrelink?". It was at that point I knew I was wasting my time and ended the call. I will just apply 3 months before my entitlement age. Thanks for the info. |
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Post by bear on Mar 22, 2020 7:39:05 GMT 7
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Post by tasjo on Mar 22, 2020 8:16:13 GMT 7
A close friend of mine went through the separated under one roof and the same thing applied as they were still married... She had to prove their finances and living arrangements were separate in order to get the single rate of payment.
Its just because being married is one of their relationship criteria, but it is only one of them... The others are to show that you are not sharing finances or a home, and therefore should qualify for single rate of payment. Dotting i's and crossing t's now will, I suspect, help save you from a debt at some point in the future if they look at the fact you are married... Or when/if you do move back in together.
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Post by dswau on Mar 23, 2020 7:00:11 GMT 7
On the subject but from a slightly different angle, I was reading the following AAT case which gives a very good insight on how the department arrives at a decision as to whether you are a couple or not. As tasjo says, the criteria that is used to decide whether you are in a relationship or not isn't entirely straightforward, but the AAT member in this decision does explain the process very well. It's also a very good example of how difficult it can be to 'unscramble' things at a later date when you've done something odd like buy a property together (!). www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/AATA/2020/374.html |
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Post by tallgirl on Mar 23, 2020 16:21:07 GMT 7
Hi all, This post can be moved to correct place. I have only posted one thread before a couple years back. Ok, a long story as short as i can. My wife and I retired, sold up and moved to Thailand to live. Things have not gone well. My wife has returned to Australia to be carer for her mum and dad. She is living in their house with them. She is on a carers payment and allowances. Due to certain commitments I have remained in Thailand for awhile. I plan to go back to live in the next couple of years. Due to circumstances I do not wish to go into on here if her parents are still alive when I return I will be living separated until her parents are no longer around. Initially she registered us as married on making her claim for payments. I am just wondering now if it would be more beneficial to her, and maybe me at a later date to register as separated/single until such time as we can be living together again. She is only 61 and a long way off OAP, which is obviously not needed at this point in time. I am still just over 2 years away from being eligible for my OAP. Well maybe as I am getting conflicting stories after being in Thailand 7 years as to when I will be entitled to the OAP in Australia. But that is another story. Had a bit of a look at the Centrelink site but, as everyone is aware, very hard to navigate. I will suggest to her she visit CL and see if she can find any info but I am asking here as to if anyone can give some advise in this matter. We are not really doing anything illegal as we are separated. Our investments have taken a beating for various reason so I guess they would have to be split. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Darral There's a difference between being legally separated and living in separate places. Legally separated means that the marriage is most likely over/done with. It's the step before divorce (unless you don't believe in divorce for personal reasons). It sounds as if you and your wife live in separate places, and have disconnected finances, but consider yourself married. You say you intend to reunite with her in the future, including living with her once her parents are no longer in the picture. This is not the kind of separated that would allow her to claim higher carer rates. It's possible (likely?) that Centrelink wouldn't catch her if she chose to declare herself separated to Centrelink. But it would be fraud and they'd have an interest in clawing back the money if they figured it out. Some questions Centrelink staff asked me to help me understand what they considered separated: "Have you announced to your family and all your friends that the relationship has ended?" "If something catastrophic happened, would you take care of 'X'?" "Do you intend to stay in communication with 'X' or attend any future events/gatherings with them?" As far as Centrelink was concerned if my husband and I completely disentangled our lives and then he wrote me friendly emails or I went to one of his family dinners, that would be enough to show we were still providing each other with emotional support and were still a couple. edit: I'll note in our case that we don't have kids. If we had children, Centrelink would expect us to do things together for our kids benefit while allowing for the separation. |
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